Best type for travel

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Best to read all of Dr Thomas's site and see his conclusions. It's very interesting story.
He features on the Python site with P1, P3, and P4 2 wheel pythons, but he has designed trikes too.
I would use his Jetrike II as it's the closest to Pauls, that's what I may do sometime.
If you can't download plans or see pictures, go to the Chinese version rip off site. It has everything.
I have the plans 21 pages pdf. Easy to change to non-tilting common back axle or stubs.

Best regards
Martin.
 
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Whilst the Jetrike works as a tilting delta trike with a MBB front end it does NOT work with a Python front end.

Someone on the Python mailing list built one the forces at the pivot are so great they ripped the trike apart and it was abandoned as an idea.

Thomas does a assessment after a year riding his trike and came to the conclusion for his commutes to work he does not need tilting , most tilters are heavier and more complicated than a normal trike , maybe that weight and complexity could be better spent on suspension ? we don't all ride Dutch cycling infrastructure !

Paul
 
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There are some plans here :- Hipparion

Page 2 At bottom

It is chunky because it is large section aluminium , in steel it would be much more svelt.
It is almost a Python except for the pivot angle is different.

See here Glens delta

Some more trikes here Openbike

Paul
 
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Whilst the Jetrike works as a tilting delta trike with a MBB front end it does NOT work with a Python front end.

Someone on the Python mailing list built one the forces at the pivot are so great they ripped the trike apart and it was abandoned as an idea.

Thomas does a assessment after a year riding his trike and came to the conclusion for his commutes to work he does not need tilting , most tilters are heavier and more complicated than a normal trike , maybe that weight and complexity could be better spent on suspension ? we don't all ride Dutch cycling infrastructure !

Paul
Yes I agree, that's why I'm keeping things simple and sticking with the Warrior (beefed up). It should do all I want.
It does follow where most of the commercial trikes are at now, so that means I have a good chance of sorting it out.

If I need something tilting, I could just ride one of my suspension mountain bikes!

Jetrike works as a tilting delta trike with a MBB front end, OK. So don't mess with it! Beefing the pivot area may be a good idea!

Martin
 
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No there are no plans.

There is a thread :- Python trikes

I would suggest you copy the yellow front and either the black or blue rear end first and leave the tilting one till you have some seat time on a Python trike.

These are for a 2 wheeler Python plans and easily turned into a trike

There are others I need to find them.

What do you mean by ' want to carry cargo ' ?
Big lumps of stuff of camping gear ?

Paul
I mean camping gear.
Thanks
 
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I mean camping gear. Thanks
Camping gear opens up lots of possibilities for storage as apart from the tent and sleeping bag the other bits can be distributed amongst lot's of smaller bags that can fit in awkward shaped containers [ fairings etc ]

Paul
 
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You look for a touring Trike.
This means that you need a strong reliable Trike that can carry your stuff.

My advice, look ad Tadpole Trikes. Not the racer afcource. Those are to low to the ground and aren't made for comfort.

My advice, build a tadpole that has a short wheelbase. As least rear suspension, not to low to the ground and a strong rear luggage rack where you can put all your stuff on.
Use in the back also a 20inch wheel.
Gear not for speed, but for a nice cruising speed and for climbing hills.
A good seat that you can adjust to your liking.

The short wheelbase is better, because it gives you a bit more traction. A 20 inch rear wheel helps with that, to get it closer you your seat to gain traction.

Yes, best is full suspension, but that makes the Trike also more vulnerable for problems.
As you go touring, you want a reliable Trike.
As this will be your first time, it is better to go for the safer option and only use rear suspension. With the lower speeds you ride, you don't need full suspension.

Build a strong luggage rack that can hold your bags. You put a lot of weight on them and you don't want them to brake.
Also check what bags you want to use and use them to design your rack.

Gearing is important.
Your Trike is with everything you have, not the lightest. This makes that you need to use more power to go forward, especially in the mountains and as the roads are bad.
Lighter gearing helps a lot.

I see that you want to use an e-assist.
Do you go for a mid or hub motor?

I am going to build a quad gof my trips with full suspension. But this because I need to pull a caravan and also want to use it off-road.
 
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You look for a touring Trike.
This means that you need a strong reliable Trike that can carry your stuff.

My advice, look ad Tadpole Trikes. Not the racer afcource. Those are to low to the ground and aren't made for comfort.

My advice, build a tadpole that has a short wheelbase. As least rear suspension, not to low to the ground and a strong rear luggage rack where you can put all your stuff on.
Use in the back also a 20inch wheel.
Gear not for speed, but for a nice cruising speed and for climbing hills.
A good seat that you can adjust to your liking.

The short wheelbase is better, because it gives you a bit more traction. A 20 inch rear wheel helps with that, to get it closer you your seat to gain traction.

Yes, best is full suspension, but that makes the Trike also more vulnerable for problems.
As you go touring, you want a reliable Trike.
As this will be your first time, it is better to go for the safer option and only use rear suspension. With the lower speeds you ride, you don't need full suspension.

Build a strong luggage rack that can hold your bags. You put a lot of weight on them and you don't want them to brake.
Also check what bags you want to use and use them to design your rack.

Gearing is important.
Your Trike is with everything you have, not the lightest. This makes that you need to use more power to go forward, especially in the mountains and as the roads are bad.
Lighter gearing helps a lot.

I see that you want to use an e-assist.
Do you go for a mid or hub motor?

I am going to build a quad gof my trips with full suspension. But this because I need to pull a caravan and also want to use it off-road.
Is there an already built one similar to your recommendations? To "see" your ideas.
I think hub motor is simpler, but as you can see, I'm studying the options.

Thanks
 
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Is there an already built one similar to your recommendations? To "see" your ideas.
I think hub motor is simpler, but as you can see, I'm studying the options.

Thanks
A design from atomiczombie.com that works well with a few changes, is the street fox.
It is a very simple design, but very effective.
With a 20inch rear wheel and a good seat, you have a great base to start with.
It has rear suspension and with a good luggage rack, you can carry a lot of stuff with you.
You need to strengthen the points where the arms are mounted to the frame, but that is all.

Here are 2 images of a greenspeed. The top one is the 26 and the bottom one is the 20. There is also a 20rs. That one has suspension, but is gof the rest the same as the 20.


As you can see, the 20 has a big shorter wheel base, what helps with traction.
Those Trikes are great for touring.

20 inch has disadvantages, but also advantages.
The biggest one is traction and as you don't know what kind of roads you encounter, tgsn that is a thing I would choose after my experiences from the last 2 years.

I traveled with this combo for the last 2 years.

I missed traction and ground clearance. It is lower than it looks.
The traction was not only on sand and gravel, it was also a problem as the Asphalt was wet and the hills where steep.


This is the street fox.
It is a simple but great design.
Replace the seat, use disk brakes and a 20inch in the rear. This brings the center of the wheel a bit closer to the seat.
Ad a luggage rack on the rear wheel and you are ready to go.
Mayby ad some support in the center of the arms where they are connected to the frame.
You can ad undersea staring if you want, that is all up to you.
 
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The main disadvantage of a hub motor is the fact it can't benefit from the drivetrain.
The main advantage -if a throttle is mounted- is that it can be used without the chain.
I forgot that part.
Maddox is right and there is more.

A hub motor needs to spin ad a surten speed as it delivers power. As it can't spin fast enough, it will overhead. It will have protection, but then it will shut down.

With a mid motor, you don't have this problem.
I noticed even with my motor that has a torque sensor, that as I ride with lighter gears, it uses less power and is more efficient.
It delivers when it is needed and lowers the power as you give less power.
Playing with the gears, makes tgag you get more range.
 
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I work with elektric motors for work and intensive hobby. My Grey Ghost is used so the motor can spin as fast as possible. It's something Emiel and me talked about earlier.
Idealy you pedal between 70 and 90rpm, but the motor can run as high as possible.

For me, I would need a bottom bracket with a 36 tooth pinion, to a 44 gear on the crank of a BBS02b and from there to the normal gear ratios on the wheel.
 
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Many opinions, good information, delta, tadpole, python, motors... Thank you all, I am overwhelmed with so much info, now to read and study.

Best regards
 
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Messages
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You look for a touring Trike.
This means that you need a strong reliable Trike that can carry your stuff.

My advice, look ad Tadpole Trikes. Not the racer afcource. Those are to low to the ground and aren't made for comfort.

My advice, build a tadpole that has a short wheelbase. As least rear suspension, not to low to the ground and a strong rear luggage rack where you can put all your stuff on.
Use in the back also a 20inch wheel.
Gear not for speed, but for a nice cruising speed and for climbing hills.
A good seat that you can adjust to your liking.

The short wheelbase is better, because it gives you a bit more traction. A 20 inch rear wheel helps with that, to get it closer you your seat to gain traction.

Yes, best is full suspension, but that makes the Trike also more vulnerable for problems.
As you go touring, you want a reliable Trike.
As this will be your first time, it is better to go for the safer option and only use rear suspension. With the lower speeds you ride, you don't need full suspension.

Build a strong luggage rack that can hold your bags. You put a lot of weight on them and you don't want them to brake.
Also check what bags you want to use and use them to design your rack.

Gearing is important.
Your Trike is with everything you have, not the lightest. This makes that you need to use more power to go forward, especially in the mountains and as the roads are bad.
Lighter gearing helps a lot.

I see that you want to use an e-assist.
Do you go for a mid or hub motor?

I am going to build a quad gof my trips with full suspension. But this because I need to pull a caravan and also want to use it off-road.
Would you explain your reasons for tadpole Vs delta?

I'm not sure the pros/cons for touring in both cases. The Spanish I know (the web I've posted before in this thread) rides in tadpole, but comercial (HP scorpion) with solar panels as roof.
He also installed two hub motors 500w each, as he says they work easily with no heat. So he has 3 wheel drive, no traction problems.

Best regards
Manu
 
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Would you explain your reasons for tadpole Vs delta?

I'm not sure the pros/cons for touring in both cases. The Spanish I know (the web I've posted before in this thread) rides in tadpole, but comercial (HP scorpion) with solar panels as roof.
He also installed two hub motors 500w each, as he says they work easily with no heat. So he has 3 wheel drive, no traction problems.

Best regards
Manu
Why I don't know.
A delta needs overall more ground clearance than a tadpole, but other than that, i think it is because how they they are sold.
Tadpole has many different types of Trikes. From race to touring to Trikes where people with disabilities easily can get on and off from.
With deltas, you don't see that. They are mainly sold in one style.
So I think that, that is one of the big reasons.

As you ad that amount of power, than hills will be no problem.

Before you leave, check the rules wat is allowed in witch country regarding e-assist.
The risk is small to get in problems with that, but you never know. You can get an accident and things can change as your setup isn't according the rules.
It is best to check that before you visit a country so you know what the risks are as you use more power.

Where do you want to ride, in witch countries?
 
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Why I don't know.
A delta needs overall more ground clearance than a tadpole, but other than that, i think it is because how they they are sold.
Tadpole has many different types of Trikes. From race to touring to Trikes where people with disabilities easily can get on and off from.
With deltas, you don't see that. They are mainly sold in one style.
So I think that, that is one of the big reasons.

As you ad that amount of power, than hills will be no problem.

Before you leave, check the rules wat is allowed in witch country regarding e-assist.
The risk is small to get in problems with that, but you never know. You can get an accident and things can change as your setup isn't according the rules.
It is best to check that before you visit a country so you know what the risks are as you use more power.

Where do you want to ride, in witch countries?
My idea is Europe (I live in Spain) and Morroco. My intention is only a 250w motor, so no problem, and probably 2wd (one motor and the other pedal).

By the way, looking to KIS in my first try, I was thinking in a loderunner (just to practice building/welding).
Maybe with brakes and sprockets in the usual place in a bike (not in the middle, but close to the wheel). That way the central part of the back would be flat in the under side, allowing to build that part lower than the plans and free of staff, while keeping the distance to the floor (to avoid breaking something in a kick with a stone).

An example is what Hugh did in his trike but with 20':


https://www.atomiczombie.com/forum/threads/2wd-delta.791/post-12826

Just thinking
Best regards
Manu
 
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You prefer a delta as I see that you want to use that rear system with the motor.
I think it will be fine and a lot easier with making a nice storage space in the back for your stuff.

Now if is looking ad what you want and need.
I would advice to ad rear suspension and a good seat. Comfort for traveling is important.
As you don't sit good and the ride is very uncomfortable, than it will be a lot less pleasant and way heavier.
The rear suspension will not solve everything, but it helps to make it a lot smoother.
The seat hight and position also changes the experience.

I am very curious what you are going to build.
Normally you see tadpoles, so as you go for a delta, it is something different.
I am going to build a quad. Also with a hub motor, but that will be connected to a diff, that powers my both rear wheels.
 
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Messages
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You prefer a delta as I see that you want to use that rear system with the motor.
I think it will be fine and a lot easier with making a nice storage space in the back for your stuff.

Now if is looking ad what you want and need.
I would advice to ad rear suspension and a good seat. Comfort for traveling is important.
As you don't sit good and the ride is very uncomfortable, than it will be a lot less pleasant and way heavier.
The rear suspension will not solve everything, but it helps to make it a lot smoother.
The seat hight and position also changes the experience.

I am very curious what you are going to build.
Normally you see tadpoles, so as you go for a delta, it is something different.
I am going to build a quad. Also with a hub motor, but that will be connected to a diff, that powers my both rear wheels.
For the rear suspension I've seen some ideas, but for the seat I still didn't. what seats suit the job?

Thank you
Manu
 
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I bought my seats.
Side support and support till high up your back is what I prefer. A headrest is also something I ad. It will mit be against my head while riding, but for as I want to put my head back as I stand still.

The angle of your seat is what you need to try out. An adjustable seat is therefor better. You can adjust it to what you like.
 
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I admit, as a Wallet Warrior, I just would buy a mesh seat from Azub. Mine does the job for 10K km, and it's still a superb reclining seat.

But as Emiel writes, a hard shell seat as he uses, with side support has its points.

But your enviroment is a lot hotter than here and any breeze is an advantage.
 
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